Ezekiel 14:9

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And if the prophet be deceived and speak a word, I, Jehovah, have deceived that prophet, and I will stretch out my hand upon him, and will destroy him from the midst of my people Israel. (ASV)


Note that this is the same God who supposedly "cannot lie" (Numbers 23:19, 1 Samuel 15:29, Titus 1:2). It appears that God's ability to spread misinformation is not impaired. --Robert Stevens 07:39, 24 Nov 2005 (CST)

Response to Con piece: The Bible specifically states that God did this himself (not Satan or anyone else). By attempting to argue otherwise, Con is abandoning the Bible here. --Robert Stevens 08:08, 28 Jan 2008 (CST)



Edit this section to note miscellaneous facts.


The following has been moved from Con to Neutral:

There are two attributes of God that come into play here. God is omniscient so that He knows all things that are currently happening or that will happen (as well as, but not relevant here, that which has happened in the past). God is also omnipotent so that nothing and no one can prevent Him doing that which He wants to do. Consequently, we can say that God ordains all things because He knows beforehand that which will happen and has the power to intervene to prevent or change any outcome. For any outcome, we can conclude that God caused it directly or that He allowed the outcome through other causes. However, since God can intervene to prevent any outcome, He tells us to credit Him for those things that He did not cause directly because He has the power to intervene in any outcome, and it is His choice not to intervene to prevent any outcome, even those not caused directly by Him. God ordains all things, both good and bad. Good things come about because God causes them; bad things come about because God allows them through secondary causes. Yet, in both instances, God tells us that He is responsible for what has happened so he will say, "I did it."

In this passage, God speaks to Ezekiel regarding those who come to him to seek a message from God. God tells Ezekiel

“Son of man, these men have set up their idols in their heart, and put the stumblingblock of their iniquity before their face: should I be enquired of at all by them?...Therefore say unto the house of Israel, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Repent, and turn yourselves from your idols; and turn away your faces from all your abominations. For every one of the house of Israel, or of the stranger that sojourneth in Israel, which separateth himself from me, and setteth up his idols in his heart, and putteth the stumblingblock of his iniquity before his face, and cometh to a prophet to enquire of him concerning me; I the LORD will answer him by myself: And I will set my face against that man, and will make him a sign and a proverb, and I will cut him off from the midst of my people; and ye shall know that I am the LORD. And if the prophet be deceived when he hath spoken a thing, I the LORD have deceived that prophet, and I will stretch out my hand upon him, and will destroy him from the midst of my people Israel. And they shall bear the punishment of their iniquity: the punishment of the prophet shall be even as the punishment of him that seeketh unto him; That the house of Israel may go no more astray from me, neither be polluted any more with all their transgressions; but that they may be my people, and I may be their God, saith the Lord GOD.” (Ezekiel 14:3-11)

God does not have to be the direct cause of the prophet being deceived because He is able to allow the prophet to be deceived through other means. Even though God says, "I the LORD will answer him by myself," this does not mean that the prophet will understand accurately that which God has said or be able to explain that which God says to the people. In this case, the prophet may wrongly interpret God's message so that the people think that they can continue in their idolatry and in doing so, they are destroyed. Where the prophet wrongly understands God's message so that he ends up deceiving the people by telling them something that God did not say, God says, "I the LORD have deceived that prophet." This is because God did not intervene to correct the prophet when He saw that the prophet misunderstood the message.

Because God is both omniscient and omnipotent, He ordains all things and takes responsibility for all things even when He is not the direct cause of all things.


Reason for move = Not responsive to Pro argument.

--JoeWallack 10:54, 1 Feb 2008 (CST)

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